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Thread: Crucible tools thread

  1. #21
    technically, he is giving all of the dimensions of everything, all of the camera angles he has, he's assembling everything on that placemat and the lines are accurately placed in the grid, each line is 1cm. It should give you a very good idea on sizes for everything.
    Last edited by cae2100; 03-01-2017 at 02:02 AM.

  2. #22
    I was thinking that too CAE. Sure those arent Inch marks? lol
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  3. #23
    it might be, for some reason, it looked like the grid was too small for it to be an inch, but I think you may be right, it might be inches.

    Edit: yea, it is in inches, at 5:38, there's a sharpie marker, which from end to end is around 4 3/4" or 12cm, it is inches that the grid is done at.

  4. #24
    So what if Brian doesnt fork over a CAD file??? I have inventor, but no time to draw it up at the moment. NO way will the wife be smiling if I show up with a 250dollar crucible plucker. I have to produce SOMETHING in bronze and soon. I warned her in the beginning I would have about 5grand in the first thing I made and it would be hers. :-O (keeping in mind it was the main reason I NEEDED a bad ass tig welder) :-)
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  5. #25
    Senior Member r4z0r7o3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jagboy69 View Post
    keeping in mind it was the main reason I NEEDED a bad ass tig welder
    Nononono, totally the wrong wording to use. You REQUIREa bad ass tig welder. How in the fook are you expected to connect all those itsy-bitsy bronze chain-links together to hold up her first casting around her neck?????

    I mean common! Tig welder is simply necessary, the entire process is absolutely impossible without one.

    250dollar crucible plucker
    Have you seen his business? Near as I can tell he's got his own line of 3d CAD/CAM gear. I posted a comment on his original burner vid., trying to get a parts list. He wrote me back saying "soon", but the list never materialized. Something tells me he's more into "intellectual property" than joining "hive-mind of collaboration". His loss.

    In any case, I still believe Gingery was right, it's easier to lift up the entire furnace, than use lifting + pouring tongs. Nobody can argue with Gingery. His designs are available, and absolutely perfect. No mistakes, no errors, nothing at all wrong with them, not even one screw is wrong

    /me will be joining the bent-up, banged-on scrap-iron, separate lifting and pouring tongs club soon.

    I'm torn between Gingery's tong design (seems flimsy) and Tobho's


    Man those are just bad-ass looking. I'm totally with the thinking, "if you don't know how strong it needs to be, overbuild the hell out of it". Just gotta find a pair of rusty hay-forks on craigs-list and I'm set!
    Last edited by r4z0r7o3; 03-01-2017 at 01:29 PM.
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  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by jagboy69 View Post
    BOOM! And he makes a VIDEO! Brilliant timing for me! The cad file would be nice



    Brian nicely executes his concept. I suspect his mechanism provides some mechanical advantage but it appears if you don’t maintain the squeeze on the lever you could drop the crucible. I would think it preferable for the device to lock on the crucible and then actuation be required to release it. It’s possible to design a mechanism such that the lifting weight increases the grip by the tongs.

    I would have also like to have seen him actually pour with it in the video.

    I experimented with a number of approaches by pouring sand and denser abrasive media, including design similar to Brian’s which is reallya crucible adapted version of that often seen in use with steel crucibles such as Tobho Mott’s example in post #11.

    I found that approach worked fine when the overall length of the tong/shank was small and crucible was modest weight. In the size shown with aluminum I’m sure that was the case, but load it with bronze and/or iron and you have a much heavier one arm lift with a gloved hand over a very hot pool of metal.
    When it came to controlling the pour, I couldn’t beat the traditional side pouring shank, especially if the shank gripped the crucible close to thecenter of gravity. The only issue was to insure the crucible could not tip out of the shank for which many have incorporated clasps.

    If you have a lift off or tipping body furnace like Junyard’s that exposes the crucible, an open throat ring shank can be used to both snatch and pour the crucible with a single simple device.

    Here’s mine for the A10.



    I have a similar one for my A20 but it’s a handful even with aluminum so I also have a pouring cart for and gripping mechanism for A20 up to A60. I think the game changes when you get to larger/heavier crucibles for one man pours.

    Best,
    Kelly
    My furnace build ----- I toil and fettle then foam turns to metal!

  7. #27
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    I don't have any idea what his metal working setup looks like but cutting/drilling/forming all of those parts would take me a couple of months of Sundays. Even then, having it all fit right would take another month of tweaking.
    Even the one I made with just a few moving parts took awhile.


    Pete

  8. #28
    Senior Member r4z0r7o3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kcoffield View Post
    Here’s mine for the A10.
    Those are sexy! Care to post some closeups or describe the build? I'd love to make a pair like that. I started one using Gingery's design, but it's just too flimsy for an A8 or larger. I also need to make at least one half-arse-attempt at lift-out grabbers. Just in case my furnace-raising mechanism totally fails for any reason.
    "Things that are complex are not useful, things that are useful are simple."
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  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by r4z0r7o3 View Post
    Those are sexy! Care to post some closeups or describe the build? I'd love to make a pair like that. I started one using Gingery's design, but it's just too flimsy for an A8 or larger. I also need to make at least one half-arse-attempt at lift-out grabbers. Just in case my furnace-raising mechanism totally fails for any reason.
    Sure.

    On the first bit of experimenting and test piece, I just took a piece of scrap ” tube and fed it through my slip roll until it was the diameter that landed on the CG of the crucible. Then I trimmed the opening until it would slip over the base of the crucible. This looked good but a ” tube wasn’t going to be stout enough so I figured I’d ultimately use 1/8” mild steel. Before I cut the heavier steel I tried a piece of scrap 18 ga which just took a couple minutes to cut on the band saw and slip roll.

    Though the shape of the A-series crucibles is a bit rounded, I figured a cone was a pretty good approximation to gripping the surface. So I used a piece of paper to measure the circumference half the ring height above and below the approximate center of gravity of the crucible.

    I used the circumference to calculate the radius of each curve and made a paper template that is a frustum of a cone. By trimming the opening of the ring back at an angle, I found it allowed the ring opening to be smaller to provide the best grip and containment of the crucible yet still allow it to be tilted and easily slip over the base of the crucible.

    So, I used the template to cut the 1/8” mild steel stock. I can’t slip roll 1/8” stock so I just hand formed it around a piece of 6” pipe and did some additional convincing with a hammer until it gave up and decided to conform to the crucible. I then made the outer rib, and welded it in place with the tube stub on the crucible. You can see the progression at the picture elow.



    I made similar open ring shanks for each of my A4, A10, and A20.The A4 & A10 mount on 1” diameter tube. The A20 uses 1 ” pipe as a handle. It can be used free hand but also mounts on my pouring cart.



    Here’s a close up of the A10.



    I found that T-handle clamped on the handle as shown in the picture wasn’t as comfortable to pour with as just grabbing the handle, so I added a piece that allows it to slide and clamp in place to capture the crucible. Sorry, don’t have a picture of that.

    I don’t have any video of manual lifting with the open ring shank but I do have the A20 version being used on my pouring cart. If you go to post #9 on page 1 of my build thread at the link in my signature block below, there are more pictures and video there. There’s also the same for my A60 shank. Grabbing the A60 is another story. That thing is a beast and my shank for that is more complex with active jaws though an open ring probably would have worked there too. I picked up open ring approach from Junkyard after I had already built the A60 jaws.

    Best,
    Kelly
    Last edited by kcoffield; 03-01-2017 at 07:22 PM.
    My furnace build ----- I toil and fettle then foam turns to metal!

  10. #30
    Senior Member r4z0r7o3's Avatar
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    Awesome, thanks! The build-progression pic is helpful, that gives me a great idea of how it's done. I really like your design, nice and simple.
    "Things that are complex are not useful, things that are useful are simple."
    - Mikhail Kalashnikov

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